Interview on The Executive Edge Podcast with Sue Firth: Enhancing Diversity and Inclusion
Dec 26, 2023Episode 58
Dr. Raymona H. Lawrence
In this episode, we feature an interview on The Executive Edge Podcast with Dr. Raymona as the guest. Dr. Raymona, along with Sue Firth, the host of The Executive Edge Podcast, unveils the transformative power of the ROAR framework in crafting inclusive business communities. Prepare to challenge your own unconscious biases in recruitment and learn the vital connection between a company’s commitment to diversity and its overall triumph. It's a session packed with insightful strategies for culture consultants and business strategists alike, aimed at dismantling the systems that hinder genuine inclusivity and personal growth. Embark on a quest to uncover actionable steps toward fostering conversations that lead to substantial societal and business improvements.
In this episode, we talk about the following... 1. The significance of recognizing that both personal and systemic factors contribute to the challenges of diversity and inclusion. 2. How to implement the ROAR framework for business improvement. 3. The importance of education and self-reflection as initial steps in fostering diversity, equity, and inclusion.
In this episode, we feature an interview on The Executive Edge Podcast with Dr. Raymona as the guest. Dr. Raymona, along with Sue Firth, the host of The Executive Edge Podcast, unveils the transformative power of the ROAR framework in crafting inclusive business communities. Prepare to challenge your own unconscious biases in recruitment and learn the vital connection between a company’s commitment to diversity and its overall triumph. It's a session packed with insightful strategies for culture consultants and business strategists alike, aimed at dismantling the systems that hinder genuine inclusivity and personal growth. Embark on a quest to uncover actionable steps toward fostering conversations that lead to substantial societal and business improvements.
In this episode, we talk about the following... 1. The significance of recognizing that both personal and systemic factors contribute to the challenges of diversity and inclusion. 2. How to implement the ROAR framework for business improvement. 3. The importance of education and self-reflection as initial steps in fostering diversity, equity, and inclusion.
Welcome to this week's episode of the Inclusive Networker podcast, where we help network marketers, small business owners and solopreneurs become aware of gaps in knowledge or awareness that could be keeping their networks and businesses small. Tune in as we give tips and simple practical tools to make your business more inclusive and we teach you how to build inclusive communities that support diverse customers, team members and business partners. So if you want to authentically build relationships with diverse communities of customers or business partners, you are in the right place. But be warned you will be challenged. But here's the thing you won't be judged. I'm your host, dr Ramona. I'm a speaker, coach, consultant, public health professor, wife, mom and a fierce challenger of broken systems that keep people from reaching their highest potential. I'm so excited to be with you on your journey to becoming an inclusive networker, so let's jump right in.
Speaker 1:
Hey, hey, hey and welcome, welcome, welcome to this week's episode of the Inclusive Networker podcast. I am highlighting wonderful podcast hosts who have called me into conversation, and this week I am highlighting Sue Firth of the Executive Edge. We had an amazing conversation about my Roar framework. You all know that Roar is recruitment, onboarding, activity and retention. We talked about that. We talked about that in terms of recruitment and addressing unconscious bias, diversifying candidate pools, avoiding hiring individuals that are like our current employees. We really dug down into the significance of prioritizing employee and customer satisfaction. We talked about all kinds of things where you can truly relate diversity, equity and inclusion to your business practices, and so, if you are looking to foster a positive culture of continuous learning, growth and improvement, jump into this episode of the Inclusive Networker, which is a replay of the work that I did with Sue Firth on her podcast, the Executive Edge.
Speaker 2:
Now you are a culture consultant and a strategist in an area or sector, if you like, of the process, of both a policy, a process, an understanding, a treatment. It is just everything, because it is really about diversity, equity and inclusion. So do you want to introduce yourself better than I have just done? Tell us more about you, please.
Speaker 1:
No, you are spot on. I am a speaker or a coach or consultant, and I also have a SaaS business and that systems as a service or software as a service, and so I look at diversity, equity and inclusion across different aspects of life. And so, yes, we look at the diversity, equity and inclusion in your personal life, but also in business. And so I think of diversity, equity and inclusion as a systems issue, and my passion is I've always said that I am a person that is on a mission to challenge broken systems that keep people from reaching their highest potential. And so, when you think about the issue of diversity, equity and inclusion, a lot of times there are systems that keep people from reaching their highest position or potential there, but then there's also systems in our daily life, our business, our workflow that keeps us from reaching our highest potential, and so I kind of look at both. I look at the environment that we're creating for people as well as the actual systems and tools that they have in their business and in their life.
Speaker 2:
Right, and I think that's a brilliant place to start and thank you. So, if you were, sort of try to characterize what you feel we are getting right at the moment, are we getting anything right, or should we be almost challenging ourselves? To go back to the basics on pretty much this whole topic from start to finish, what? Where do we, you know, begin?
Speaker 1:
Yeah, I think that it's hard to say what's right or wrong, and I think that we are at a point where we're now having conversations and not necessarily let me rephrase that a little bit We've been having the conversation, but more people are listening and taking action at this point. Right, and I think a lot of people have been saying this is an issue, this is what's wrong there. People are being marginalized, people are. The environments are not inclusive. They don't. They're not set up for everybody to be able to thrive. People have said that for a very long time. But at this point now the door is open a little bit more for us to really start to have the conversations and actually take action.
Speaker 1:
And people aren't going back to saying it's okay, you know, just treat people any kind of way. And one of the things that I always tell people is that now people are craving the full story of history of life. They are not just wanting to say this is one perspective and this is how it is and this is what I've been told and I'm going with it. That is no more. And so now I think what's going right is that we're having the conversation, we're looking at different perspectives and we're now starting to take some action. Do we have a long way to go? Absolutely Right, there are things that need to happen. People are still not treated equitably in every situation in this country, but I think that we are moving in the right direction.
Speaker 2:
And that's great. Thank you and a brilliant summation. I suppose what I still find rather shocking, both as a person and as a psychologist, is that we need to do this, that we treat people so differently. I mean, there are numerous cultures who feel that they have been deprived in some way, shape or form, and it begs the question you know, why do we seem to take this almost supremacy or supremist kind of view of things? So, from your perspective, the fact that we're now opening the dialogue clearly feels a good first step. What's the next step, however obvious, please, so that you can spell it out for us all.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, oh goodness. And so, you know, the first thing is having the conversation, and I think the next step is identifying the people who are willing to take the action. You know, you know we have a lot of conversations, and I think that when I do my work with diversity, equity and inclusion, we often talk about not feeding state to babies. We think about this continuum.
Speaker 1:
Okay, and so what do I mean by not feeding state to babies? I mean that there are some people who aren't ready for difficult conversations, or they're not ready to talk about race in this country, they're not ready to talk about people who have different lifestyles. They are not ready to have that conversation. And so we who are ready often have tried to just say it's time, it's a moral obligation, we need to talk about these things, and we're talking to people who are not digesting what we're saying, and so that has taken us to a place where we are just hitting a wall. So I think that it's time now to feed things to people in the place that they are.
Speaker 1:
So if some people need a lighter conversation about diversity, equity and inclusion, then sometimes we have to come to them with here's the business case for diversity, equity and inclusion and not just start with a moral imperative. And it's unfortunate because we say of course you should be doing this right, but that's not where everybody is and so we have no point. Where are the people that are going to take action, who are ready? Let's focus our efforts there and then start to make a plan and move forward with our policies and the different aspects of diversity, equity and inclusion that we can make real change in our country or in your business wherever you are.
Speaker 1:
A lot of times, I always tell people, sue, that we need to determine our place of disruption. So what I mean by that is that everybody thinks that when I talk about diversity, equity and inclusion, that they need to hop out on the street with a sign and start protesting things. That is not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is in your own environment. How are you looking at your own lens no-transcript and your own background and just changing things with your own mindset so that you're not biased towards people, right? So it's just these simple things that we can start doing. So the first thing is determine your own disruption and what do you want? What are you willing to disrupt in this DEI space? Whatever that is Right, go with it.
Speaker 2:
Right In order, in order to start those conversations, to be open and receptive about ideas, but then actually to adopt something that is brought up as a solution, a conclusion or idea, absolutely and maybe in some cases a better process. So one of the critical areas, for example in business, where they are often lacking parity of some form, can be the recruitment process. Other places can be your promotion and really the way that you set up your internal succession plans and so forth because you may favor one person or favor one culture or whatever it is.
Speaker 2:
So really it's having that honesty piece, that courage piece, but then also not being so sensitive around it, if I may dare say that, that you start getting wrapped up in how you express it. Or is it okay to have a forum on DEI or not? Because actually unless you have some point where you begin, you're not going to begin right. It kind of you know, we have to do this somewhere.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, and so my regular job is a professor. I'm a public health professor and I always think about you. Know how do I break things down to people in actionable ways, in ways that they can really start to take action, and when I teach people about what they need to do with DEI in the workplace or what they need to do in their own life, I use an acronym, and that acronym is ROAR. And with ROAR, one thing that I found is that individuals, I would say, get out there, advocate for people, talk to people. You know, make sure that you stick up for others, and I realized that people couldn't even advocate for themselves, and so I started to think ROAR, how do you have your own voice in this space, which goes with finding your own area of disruption, whatever that may be? So then, you know, speak out. But ROAR also stands for recruitment, onboarding, activity and retention, and what I found is that in any area.
Speaker 1:
when I'm looking at the break in your system in the area of inclusion, that it's in recruitment, onboarding, activity or retention In any business, I can look in those places and say, oh, you have some bias with your recruitment. You're only recruiting people that look like you, they're from a certain area, right, you know. So we think about those things. What is your unconscious bias? The things that you're not even thinking about, that you're bringing in with recruitment. So we start with recruitment. So if you don't have any issues there, which people normally do, but if you don't have anything there, we go to onboarding. So one issue with onboarding. And when we're thinking about diversity, equity and inclusion with onboarding, we recruit for diversity but we onboard for conformity. Typically Good point, yeah. So it's a big issue. And we're bringing people in and we're like why don't they thrive? Why are they not able to get to the top of my company or do the things that I see this other person doing? I'm doing the same thing with them. Well, we have to start to think about what's happening. Are we looking at how this business works in their culture, in their environment, in their lifestyle, and so starting to think about how do we look at these processes that we have for onboarding from different perspectives. So how is this gonna work for a single mom? How is it gonna work for a black woman versus a white woman in their environments, right? And so we just have to think about those things.
Speaker 1:
Then the activity how are we ensuring that people are able to give all an accountability? So all is with. With whatever I'm selling, I need to make sure that I'm wowing the person, and I need that is that has bought it, and I need to ensure that I'm accountable to them. And so I look at that. What is your activity? How are you ensuring that people are getting what they are promised? And then the last thing is retention. How am I making sure that the the customer is happy, the team member is happy, that they're not just happy like I've got to please everybody, but they're getting the things that they need so that we retain them and there's not a constant revolving door? So that was a long answer to your question, but that's how I help people to start this process, as we look at those the recruitment, the onboarding, the activity and retention and we look into it with a diversity and inclusion lens.
Speaker 2:
And that's brilliant. Thank you, because I think what that lens does is sharpen the focus better, but also because your knowledge base is something that quite possibly to cut people some slack, other people don't appreciate that they're getting quite as badly wrong as they might be doing, or, put another way, there are better opportunities and better ways they could be leveraging this, a better understanding, and that's what they also need. For many of us, if I may be so ignorant, we trundle along doing the same things because no one is telling us we should be doing it differently, or we may not be asking the right questions and super aware of what it is that we're getting wrong on those touch points. So the very fact that you have that model is at least super helpful, for the obvious reasons that you come along and ask those challenging questions. So it's a two way street.
Speaker 2:
It's not just the fact that we, as business owners should have courage to open this dialogue, but I do also agree with you, if I may, that some of what we're seeing, you know, purported on the television and on the papers, makes it such a rebellious, aggressive sort of fight that it, it it starts to become very threatening as opposed to look. You know, this is an important matter for people. It's a people issue. Your people, we're people, we matter. You know, this is what. This is what people should be saying, and I think we, instead we make a mistake and we turn it into something that's literally that we're getting wrong and this is what puts us on the back foot. So I think you know really what you're saying also is a very interesting way in which we should be retaining talent better than we are doing.
Speaker 2:
You know we might be getting the onboarding process right, but from then on in it falls down. So it's great, Absolutely.
Speaker 1:
It's great.
Speaker 2:
So developing our skill, developing our knowledge, our understanding, and then perhaps questioning what we're getting right, but additionally adding processes, is part of what you do, I'm assuming. How do you begin? Do you come in with an initial consultation, or is there a questionnaire approach, or do you have coaches? How do you work?
Speaker 1:
Yes. So I come in with the business owner and I talk them through this war framework, and so there's nine different phases that I go through and we talk to them about how are you generating leads? And I'm always looking at everything with a, like I said, diversity and inclusion lens, and so I'm taking them through the process of what would happen if you bought somebody on all the way to that process where there's a referral that's happening, and so I'm talking to them about lead generation. How do you attract those leads? How do you start to educate people? How do you offer them the thing that you want to sell them or you want them to take part in? And then, when you're going into the onboarding now, how do you educate them at the next phase? Because the first education was about you and what you do.
Speaker 1:
The next education phase is I need to make sure that they know how to do what it is that I'm doing and that it fits in their environment, and I always try to teach people. A lot of times, business owners mess up because we give people recipes. So if you think about, like your grandma or somebody that's cooking in the kitchen, they know that they need to just make things and they need to know how to cook, but they don't have to follow an exact recipe, because they might not have the exact same ingredients when they go to another kitchen to make it. So your grandma taught you how to eat and how to make sure you were able to survive, not just to cook with this only one spice.
Speaker 1:
So that's what's happening is that we're teaching people that you've got to have this one spice to make the dish work, versus here are lots of different spices that still work if you don't have that one. So I like to tell people you know, think about this as a framework. Yes, you need some type of seasoning. Whatever that is for you and what tastes best for you is fine, but we need this seasoning. We need to make sure we heat it. You can put it in the air fryer or you can put it in the oven, it's up to you, but we need to heat it right. So it's those types of things. See that we have to say it's a framework, this is how you need to get it done, but pick from these things that best fit you right. So we're still giving them the proper onboarding and education that they need, but it's a framework instead of an exact recipe.
Speaker 2:
So absolutely, because otherwise, unwittingly, what we'd be looking for is conformity all over again, and that's really what we're fighting? Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:
And so I go through those nine steps, help people to ensure that they have their processes in place, and then we automate things. And so, a lot of the times, what's happening with business owners is that, yes, they have the heart, they're really wanting to make sure that everybody gets what they need, but it is difficult to ensure that we're sending these individual texts, individual emails. So we have to think about how do we automate this Roar framework and ensure that people go from this idea of lead generation and we have our emails and our text messages in a way that's inclusive, and we do that all the way through the process until we get to this last phase, which I call the revealed and there's more. Right, here's another service that I can offer you. Here's another way that I can serve you and that you can continue to interact with my business. Right, and there's more.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, and so that's the process that I take people through, and then all of that is automated within my platform, which I call I engage you.
Speaker 2:
Thank you. So how can people find you? I mean, let's just say that a business that's listening to you right now starts to get light bulbs and realize it's actually that there's a business case for enhancing their whole attitude and aptitude with this, and what they say to themselves is we should have been doing this a while ago, but hey, it's better now than not to do it at all. How do they, kind of first of all, find you? Would they reach out on your website in order to discover and start to have a conversation?
Speaker 1:
Yes, that is perfect. It is drremonahlaurancecom and my name is Bill, with a Y, so it's R-A-Y-M-O-N-A-H Lawrence, l-a-w-r-e-n-c-ecom, and you can go on there. You can book an I engage you demo. We can have a conversation, we can talk through your current systems and talk about where you can go from there. So, yes, go to the website and start the journey there.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, thank you, and you're also one quite a lot of the social media, I think. Once I went on the hunt, I found you in a few different places, so there are some. You know. There are some very useful resources, both on your site but also, just, you know, spread about this very important messaging out there, and really, if the only thing that you begin to do is saturate yourself in more of the appropriate messaging and more of the understanding, it's a really good place to begin.
Speaker 1:
Absolutely, absolutely. And that's the thing is that we don't have to be diversity, equity and inclusion experts. I certainly don't know it all. We all make mistakes, and that is the thing that we have to know is that we're all learning. The things that we talk about, the things that we say, evolve constantly, and so it's just where do you start? You just start with education.
Speaker 1:
You start by learning your own background, and I always ask people what is your lens? And I say you know, I was raised in the deep South in a Christian home, my mom was a teacher, my dad was a police officer. All of those things shaped how I see life and that's my lens. And so when you think about that, you think, oh, this is how I developed this particular belief or this particular thought about this group, and then you just start to learn more. You talk to people who don't look like you, and so those are the ways that you just initially start this process of being able to war, being able to find your, your voice in this space. So don't overthink it, just do something.
Speaker 2:
Just do it. Yeah, do something. Yeah, absolutely, and I think with your help and guidance today. Thank you, you have really helped us unpack this slightly complicated subject for most of us, but you have begun the process of helping us sooth that down into a basic series of steps in a process. So, ramona, it's been an absolute pleasure having you on the show. Thank you so much, and I do hope you will come on again so that we can ask you back in order to unpack this in another six months or so. So we really should have been doing something in the game.
Speaker 1:
Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. And that wraps up another episode of the Inclusive Networker Podcast. I want to express my sincere gratitude to you, our listeners, for joining us on this journey of learning and growth. Your support and engagement are truly, truly appreciated. Creating a more inclusive network and beyond starts with us, individually and collectively. Let's continue these conversations beyond the Inclusive Networker Podcast. Engage with others, challenge your own assumptions, take action to make a difference in your own spheres of influence and share, share, share this podcast with a friend. So here's what you can do next Go to drramonahlauntscom and keep up with me. Stay in touch. That's D-R-R-A-Y-M-O-N-A-H-L-A-W-R-E-N-C-E dot com. Don't forget my Y and Dr Ramona, and don't you dare forget your Y and I'll see you on the next episode of the Inclusive Networker.